How HelloFresh Successfully Educated and Converted Customers in the “Movable Middle”

How HelloFresh Successfully Educated and Converted Customers in the “Movable Middle”

A bold new logo may look good but — let’s face it — it won’t solve your customer retention problems. However, if you’re able to educate customers about the ways your product can make them healthier, less stressed about at-home meals, and then add beautiful branding on top that drives home this messaging, then you’ve got the recipe for building a loyal audience no matter what market you enter.    

Over a decade of research allowed business strategy firm APCO Insight to prove that “emotional attachment, not cognitive differentiation of rational attributes, is the most reliable predictor of brand choice and behavior.” The research identified eight emotional feelings people have toward brands: understanding, approachability, relevance, admiration, curiosity, identification, empowerment, and pride.

Connect the dots, and these are also the traits and qualities brands must communicate to drive customer connection and trust.

This is the view of Emma Baines, Global Director of Creative Services at HelloFresh, the fast-growing meal-kit provider worldwide. Baines leads the in-house creative agency working across TV and out-of-home advertising (OOH) campaigns, packaging, and digital performance marketing for five brands across 14 countries and counting. Most recently she led the rebrand of HelloFresh — a brave move in the midst of a global pandemic. 

The strategy has paid dividends, increasing customer engagement and, ultimately, bottom-line numbers. Closing out the first half of 2021, HelloFresh reported a year-over-year 83.7% increase in the number of active customers using the meal delivery service worldwide, as well as the continued global expansion of its business into new and existing markets.

In this episode of CleverTap Engage — our podcast/video series where we interview marketing leaders achieving meaningful customer engagement — co-hosts Peggy Anne Salz and John Koetsier sit down with Emma Baines to discuss why messaging and marketing must be consistent across all touchpoints and how ad creatives tie together the customer journey from consideration to subscription. 

 

The Takeaways

 

Scale Matters

How do you grow 84% in a year and deliver 600 million meals globally? Baines tells us it’s down to a “pillar approach” that allows your company to be flexible in operations and communications, connected by brand. In the case of HelloFresh, the brand and the main lime logo is what engages customers, but it also streamlines global operations. “It’s about operations and packaging,” she explains. The pickers who are picking the items for the baskets they pack often don’t read, so the logo is the guide and how they distinguish one item from another. 

Branding How Consumers Like It

Looking back to the rebrand in 2020, Baines explains how the look-and-feel of a brand can be a boost to operations — though it must be aligned with customer preferences. Customers gravitate toward “easy-to-understand” logos, Baines says. “[The brand] looks very simple and very clean, but that’s also what consumers are looking for.” 

 

Massive Opportunity in the Movable Middle

Marketers are accustomed to aiming for the broadest reach possible with appropriate metrics to  measure success. But there’s a whole cycle of success that marketers have to plan for to increase engagement, loyalty, and ultimately repeat purchases, Baines says. There’s a catch though: It’s unprofitable to advertise to people who aren’t going to buy your products, so it’s sometimes more effective to focus campaigns on the consumers in the middle — those who look the most like your buyers. 

This segment, dubbed the “movable middle” by marketing thought leader Joel Rubinson, is a strong focus — but not quite an easy win. 

“There’s this huge area in the middle, and that’s our kind of playing ground,” Baines explains. “That’s whom we need to target… and that’s where educating them on our process, and how we do that through our creative, is critical.” The focus, she says, is on customer education. It’s all about using marketing and mapping the customer journey to help customers make the connection between how HelloFresh works and what it delivers. 

“I think it’s really important that we understand the consumer or at least show how this product benefits [them]. How can this fit into your life? That’s how we’re going to be able to tap into that more emotional feeling,” she adds. “And this is something that we’ve been doing over the last three years with our TV ads and something that I’m hugely proud of this year.”

The Golden Rule of Retention

Baines, who shares her insights from focus groups, also walks us through the interesting differences between segments and how they react to advertising. 

Striking a chord with your target audience is dependent on the tone you choose for your brand communications. Consumers respond positively to personalization in messaging and marketing, Baines says. But they are quick to dismiss communications that feel condescending. “Nobody wants to be talked down to and that’s what we see,” Baines explains. “That’s very, very important when speaking to our consumers… We don’t use words like you, [as in] we do this, and you do this.” Her advice, in short: be humble.

And Baines also leaves us with valuable advice to drive retention: deliver a “very consistent consumer journey and customer experience.” Whether you’re targeting newly acquired customers or trying to persuade the movable middle to make a repeat order, “if you experience the best possible customer experience that you can get from that first ad or that first word of mouth… right through to when that’s delivered… then that’s the golden rule of retention.” It requires organization and effort, she says. “But if you get it right, that person is a loyal customer, and that is absolutely worth it. And that’s why we do what we do every day to ensure the consistency of the brand as well.”


Now… Subscribe to the Podcast

The video series is great, but sometimes you need something on-the-go. Or you just want to listen during your workout.

You can find CleverTap Engage, your new favorite podcast, here. Or get direct links to:

 

Plus, it’s a great idea to subscribe to our YouTube channel, where you’ll get notified whenever we upload new content.

The Experience Optimization Pocket Guide

Discover how to delight users with an experience that satisfies customers… and your bottom line.

Download Ebook Now

Full Transcript

 

Emma Baines

If as a new customer, as a loyal customer, as someone in the middle, if you experience the best possible customer experience that you can get from that first ad or that first word of mouth, or someone telling you about the product, right through to when that’s delivered, and you’ve cooked it, and you have enjoyed that meal and you’ve put a meal on the table that everyone enjoys, then that is the golden rule of retention.

 

John Koetsier 

If you ever want to feel like you’re on a rocket, but you don’t have $100 million to pay Elon Musk, you could always join our next guest’s company. It grew a staggering 84% last year. It’s already the biggest competitor in her category in the US and is currently the top company globally in a category forecast to grow 22% annually until 2028. By comparison, Rocket Ships might seem slow. My name is John Koetsier. Welcome to CleverTap Engage.

 

Peggy Anne Salz 

And my name is Peggy Anne Salz and today we’re chatting with Emma Baines, Global Director of Creative Services at, well I guess you could guess we talked about it enough John – HelloFresh. They delivered 600 million meals last year in 15 countries, still growing very fast. Emma leads HelloFresh’s in-house creative agency working across TV, digital performance marketing, all channels, actually five brands across 15 countries and counting. And she’s had 15 years of experience working for award-winning branding and design agencies in London, which is why we’re talking about brands, so important, that part of the journey, that part of the company. And she was also part of the team at the future laboratory that set up an online subscription-based consumers trends intelligence service. So we have the data and we have the drive. Welcome, Emma.

 

Emma Baines

Hi, what an absolute pleasure to be here. Thank you so much for having me on this show.

 

John Koetsier 

We are so pumped to have you and we are looking forward to this conversation. Emma, let’s start here; 2020 was insane for most of us. Frankly, 2021 is not that much different. How about you and HelloFresh?

 

Emma Baines

I mean, speechless, actually. It’s been a ride. Let’s put it that way. I think we all were taken aback by the events of last year. It was like a rocket and I feel, where in a very uncertain world, we suddenly became at the forefront of it, providing solutions and meal solutions and food became very, very important and suddenly we were thrust into the limelight a little bit as well more so than usual. And it was, I would say it was a roller coaster. And it was this wave, this everlasting wave. And we’re still on it, you know, we’re a company, we’re ten years this year, we celebrate our tenth anniversary in November. We’ve gone from a startup into a company in growth and essentially a unicorn and the pandemic happened, and we’ve got even more growth going on. It’s just insane. But it’s an amazing learning curve. There’s a lot of learnings and a lot of challenges. But, absolutely, a time to not lean back, let’s say and absolutely go with it, ride that wave.

 

John Koetsier 

Not lean back. Well, I have to say, Emma, your timing is impeccable because you lead a rebrand of HelloFresh right in the middle of that wave. You’re surfing that wave and boom, let’s do a rebrand. How did you approach that? You’re surfing this wave, and you’re going nuts. You’re expanding the company massively. How did you approach that? What was your objective?

 

Emma Baines

We started that project and then suddenly it hits and I’m thinking, wow, this is going to gain some traction because whenever we launch, this is like life’s changed and actually, this is the perfect time for us. So the project as it speaks, or the initiative, really snowballed into something very beneficial for the company. It was really like, almost like the perfect timing. We had to be very careful about that because from a perception point of view, from a consumer’s point of view, we didn’t want to be seen as suddenly benefiting so much from this pandemic, “look at us, we can now rebrand.” That was absolutely not what we wanted to do and so we were just very careful about how we went about that and how we communicated that. It was very important to us. But the actual rebrand itself, I joined HelloFresh, nearly three years ago, and it was on the table at that point. It was the starting point of this conversation of we have this brand. We’ve been going seven years at the time.

 

So we had three main pillars and objectives for the rebrand itself. The first one was scalability and essentially the evolution in the tech world, digital had really come on and our previous brand didn’t allow for that. There was no scalability at all. Even if you look at our logo, our previous logo, we had the words HelloFresh written within a lime, and scale that right down onto a social media post, or onto our website or somewhere like that, you can’t even read the brand. So, therefore, we had this real challenge. For example, we had two logos. We had our main lime logo that everyone’s very aware of, which is also a challenge, with the wording in, but we also had the secondary logo, its horizontal, which was actually in the end, almost bumped up to be the primary logo because it was more usable and that was the one that was on the website. So we were a brand that didn’t even have its primary logo on its website. Therefore there was an intrinsic issue within our system. We also had to take into consideration obviously, there was huge operational growth. So we’re a company in growth. We’re always growing and what does that mean for our products? And what does that mean, specifically for operations? And that what I mean about operations is like packaging and, for example, in our operations in our warehouses, we have pick and packers that perhaps can’t read. Therefore, if you’re looking at two different types of rice, or rice and a pasta, how do you distinguish? The packaging is going to look really, really similar. So, how do you distinguish that for those people to make sure that the customer gets the right product? Well, you do it through color, you do it through shape, and you do it through iconography. And so all of these things, we were realizing we didn’t really have a scalable system, it wasn’t flexible. Then last, but absolutely not least, is also the evolution and style and customer preferences and there were some things from our brands, from our previous brand that we took into the new brand, namely the color and the name. But it was really important looking at the other big players out there. And looking at okay, what’s everyone doing? What are these tech companies doing? What are the big players like Facebook and Instagram and Google, how are they rebranding? What are they doing, and they’re small tweaks. N26 made one of the smallest tweaks to their brand. But it was all because of making sure that it works from a scalability point of view and you could argue that it looks very simple and very clean but actually, that’s also what the consumers are looking for; we’re looking for clear and very easy-to-understand logos.

 

John Koetsier 

What’s really interesting here, Emma is that Peggy and I are typically talking to people who have mobile businesses and sure, brand is really critical for them absolutely. But it is entirely a digital thing. It doesn’t impact the physical world, not like HelloFresh, where you have a whole distribution network and drivers and production and a physical presence in people’s homes. That’s really interesting, and it’s a different order of challenge.

 

Emma Baines

Absolutely and that makes us really complex. Yes, and that’s where that consumer journey and that customer experience becomes really important. And that’s why the brand becomes very important to ensure that all of those touchpoints are consistent. So when you first see your digital ad or your ad on social, you’re like okay, I’m going to click on that, okay what’s the Landing Page look like? What’s this user experience? Do I understand the product? Do I want to buy this? Oh, now it’s in my home because I bought it. Does this experience match what I was expecting from the ad? And that’s really interesting and so important. So that from a branding perspective, when we also did the rebrand, we did a lot of thinking about that as well, from UX to packaging to will operations be able to work within this framework that we’ve built. So yeah, there were a lot of challenges there that we had to overcome. And we’re still, you know, there are still things that get thrown up so ever, ever, ever-changing.

 

Peggy Anne Salz 

What I’m excited about hearing, John is, you know, you think about it initially, oh, it’s the logo. And we’ve asked guests on our show what it is? Is the CMO is that in charge of the logo? This is in charge of the complete experience. It’s even the connective tissue, the consistency of the entire brand experience from the moment the customer interacts with it to all the operations in the background. And that the logo, that the creative is key to scale now that’s something different. Because now you have to really, well if you didn’t do it before, now you really respect the creative. It’s not just about engaging the user. It’s about running the company. I do want to talk about the customers for a moment because your customer base grew by millions, 83, 84% growth. That’s incredible and you had to adapt your creative. We’ve been talking about that to enable your company to scale. But you also want to cater to this audience and what you have is the loyal audience that may say, oh, I remember HelloFresh from back in the day before even Emma joined the company. And now I’ve got pandemic, you’ve got this influx of people who may be and I know a few of them myself, people who had never prepared a meal before, they just lived in the cafeteria – welcome to the real world! And I have a number of neighbors and colleagues who did exactly this because of that. It was like, I’ve got to learn how to cook, and I’m single, so I’m really in a mess and you had to get them as well. So how do you situate the creative and the elements that you need to get right?

 

Emma Baines

Yes, that’s a really poignant and timely topic at the moment. Essentially what we do and what I see my job is to do is educate the consumer on what we are. We’ve talked about that previously, and we touched upon it in terms of the product being so complex. That actually we don’t have the benefits of being Coca Cola and we’re selling a product. We’re selling a process and so that’s how we approach all of our creative and the ones that outperform the most is when we explain the product and explain the process and explain what you get as a result of that. And then there are different types of consumers and we see this in our focus groups that we always do wherever it will be in the world there’s always the person that’s never going to buy HelloFresh because they know how to cook, they don’t need us. There’s nothing they could possibly need from us at all and they’re very vocal about that and then we have our very, very loyal customers. There’s this huge area in the middle and that’s our playing ground and that’s who we would like to target and speak to. How do we do that? By educating them on our process and how we do that is through our creative. I have this – I call it this really fun game that I do – but everyone and even now interestingly and I say to people everyone’s like oh where do you work I say HelloFresh have you heard of it? Oh I know HelloFresh I know exactly I love it, love it, love it and I play this fun but mean game with them. What is it? Then they get really stumped because it’s like, oh it’s food in a bag and I think it’s delivered. I feel so mean, but for me it’s learning because I’m like okay, yeah, you know the name and the brand, so yay us, but we still need to tell you what it is to maybe convert you and there’s a lot of barriers there. And one of them is not understanding the process. Therefore I then explain to them the process kindly and we get over this awkward moment. But it is very much about explaining it and once people understand it and that’s our biggest barrier because once they get it in their homes as well. We see this from focus groups and all the research that we do. Once people see the benefits that we bring convenience, peace of mind, variety, the fun of discovery, there’s plenty of them. But once people understand that, but you have to live that to see it, you don’t believe it until you’ve got the product and that’s what we need to make is that connection between, okay, I’m telling you how it works versus, ah, I’ve got the product, and I understand it. And that movable middle is where we’re trying to target.

 

John Koetsier 

It’s so fascinating to hear you talk about this right now because I am one of those people you are trying to move. Because I’m on Reddit fairly frequently and there’s this ad campaign that I keep seeing, I can’t get away from it and it is from HelloFresh. And it’s like up to 16 free meals if I sign up coupon code, Reddit16. Just for anybody who’s listening right now. I’m sending that to my wife and we’re thinking, how should we do that? It’s a meal kit. It’s kind of cool. You know, that’s interesting, we both work from home maybe that’s a good idea. But interesting to me is, as to Peggy, the process that you go through for creative in order to get to customers. The question is, how often do marketers need a creative refresh? Because we talked to N26, Patrick Stal, and he was like, I love my logo, it’s amazing and now we just hear that he did a little tweak, hmm, interesting. Very good. How often do marketers need to do a refresh?

 

Emma Baines 

So, I think you really have to consider what you’re doing in terms of, if you’re looking at a rebrand and a creative refresh of that magnitude. There’s got to be some substance underneath and a clear objective and also these things cost money. So we need to make sure that that return on investment is going to be significant. And for us, it absolutely was going to be even if it made sure that we were quicker and we were faster and more efficient. When it comes to creative refreshes on other kinds of platforms, for example, and we’ve talked about this before Peggy in terms of what is a creative refresh and refreshing creatives on a more regular basis. And I hear this, I don’t like this word, it gives me the creeps, this creative fatigue, how do you measure that? And what is creative fatigue? Is it that that person has seen something and been targeted too many times on a particular platform? Like even yourself John mentioned, on Reddit, is that creative fatigue? And then you’re like less likely to purchase. Therefore you’ve dis-engaged. Or is it that actually that ad just isn’t working? And that’s very, very hard to decipher because it can be very, very personal. So for you, John, you might think, oh, I’ve seen this too many times now I’ve really had enough. But for someone else, it might just mean someone else might have converted, and therefore that they’re also in the funnel. So, therefore, they’re also like, not going to interact with it. Because they’re in great, it’s really hard to measure that, and I think it depends on the platform. I think it depends on what you’re looking to achieve as a business. We have specific cadences that we do things in, that we’re always playing with and seeing does that make sense? And I think, always just testing, iterating, learning, platform wise, but it’s also down to the message. I think that’s really important because you can create a beautiful creative, but if that message isn’t on point and isn’t clear, then that consumer isn’t going to pick up on that and we use discounts as one form of message. But I think there’s a lot to be said about targeting the consumer in terms of what do they want to hear? What do they need to hear in order to purchase this?

 

John Koetsier 

It’s a feeling. It’s an emotional connection. How do you build that? And how do you build that in a very rapidly changing market like yours?

 

Emma Baines 

I think it’s really important that we understand the consumer or at least show how does this product benefit you. How can this fit into your life? That’s how we’re going to be able to tap into that more emotional feeling. And this is something that we’ve been doing over the last three years with our TV ads and something that I’m hugely proud of this year. And we’ve really notched up the emotional side in some of our ads and that design side as well. We’ve got this really fresh look to our ads. They should be live now. Again, we are still following our formula of explaining the process but really trying to get under the skin of the challenges and those barriers. So when you see our ads this year, it’s got all of that messaging. It’s got everything we need to overcome our specific barriers and hopefully talk to the consumer and say this is how we can help you. Our in-house premise on it was mealtimes made easy. And this is what we always came back to was this creative platform of how can we make mealtimes easier for you? And how can that benefit you and your family?

 

Peggy Anne Salz 

I have to say something that’s standing out here for me, John, is education, customer education as an element of engagement. I’ve been reading a lot about that. But this is more in the tech, this is more like a Saas thing. They’re saying, oh, we need to educate the customer more, because then we can engage them more. And it’s like that, that b2b thing. This is the first time I’m really hearing about that in a b2c scenario and how important that education is. Now education is also personal and we’re talking about personalizing creatives. Meals are personal. Education has to be on my terms. What’s my benefit? Again, you have to have your creatives that will do this. How do you do that? How do you reflect that context, humanize your advertising, give me that educational moment? That’s entirely what I appreciate because it’s on my terms.

 

Emma Baines 

Yeah, and you said it, Peggy mealtimes meals, and food is so personal. It’s very much about how we speak to our consumers. And one thing that we’ve learned from again, a lot of consumer research and insights. And a couple of years ago, one particular focus group stuck out where we were showing them some creative, a group of 10 people, we were showing them our latest creative ideas for our TBC. There was one in there that followed this woman who was talking to the camera, and she was explaining things. And the research came back and every woman and man in the room said, oh, they’re speaking down to me, there’s an arrogance there. And we were just like, okay, that’s really interesting. We have to take a very humble approach here. Nobody wants to be talked down to and that’s what we see. And that’s very, very important here when speaking to our consumer and when I say personalizing, and just in every way that we talk to them, we need to make sure that we aren’t doing that. We don’t use words like you, you know, we do this, and you do this, that’s very important to us. And then in terms of the actual creative itself, we run a number of tests. We’ve looked at, are there specific meals and specific markets that work better, and there are some, but largely, it’s really interesting, largely people approach food in the same way. So interestingly, we are seeing that the burger, which was one of our highest performing pieces of creative or meals. We used it in our TBC two years ago as a hero dish is now not performing to the point where we don’t even really show a burger anymore, whether that be vegetarian or meat-based because it’s not performing.

And interestingly, I believe that is actually as a result, thinking about it, this is my personal opinion, but I think that’s also a result of the pandemic and that people are getting burgers and it’s seen as more of a takeaway meal. Therefore, why would I want to purchase that I can just go and get that from the takeaway? I want this sense of pride and I want this sense of achievement with my HelloFresh meal. And I think that’s particularly interesting as well in terms of personalizing. It’s why we don’t do burgers anymore, in terms of too many ads. So we’ve taken that out of the fold, but then it’s like okay, how do we personalize this bit more what foods are going to work a little bit more for this particular target audience. Largely speaking its, as I mentioned, it’s very similar across the board, but there are some nuances that we have to take care of as well.

 

Peggy Anne Salz 

Of course, to personalize, you also need to segment. I’d love to understand more about your segmentation strategy. It’s probably a show in itself. But let’s focus on the two things that matter. At one level, it’s very much about focusing on your loyal customers because they’re your high-value customers, or they’re close to being loyal. They’re just on the level of that. And then you mention it yourself and I’d love to hear you unpack this, the movable middle. And what I would like to hear more about is how you optimize the creative based on your segmentation strategy to target high-value users and maybe move and nudge a few from the movable middle up to that end of the spectrum.

 

Emma Baines 

Yeah, that’s a very important topic and one that I’m constantly asking myself and looking for ways to do so. Essentially, we are looking for conversions. We’re looking to move that movable middle, as you said, into those loyal customers. How do we do that? By constantly changing our creatives and trying to understand what is it that’s going to get them over the line, let’s say. We’re looking at this across the world. For example, in Australia right now, we’re seeing an increase in conversions, but that’s not due to the creative. That’s due to the fact that they’re in lockdown and we’re benefiting from that, which is amazing. But also, then it becomes okay, how do we retain those? How do we make them loyal consumers? That is largely yes down to the creative, and the customer journey and the consumer experience, but also the product that is this holistic experience as well, that’s really important to ensure that we can deliver that for them.

 

John Koetsier 

Emma, what are the metrics that you look at most closely to determine if your creatives are working?

 

Emma Baines 

Conversion rate mostly. We look at click-through rate, but conversion rate mostly. Which is challenging for me, because click-through rates, that for me is our job is to get people into the funnel. And conversion rate, obviously, we want to make sure that they convert, but there’s a whole lot of things that can happen down that line, once they’re in that funnel, that could go wrong. As consumers, we’re really fickle. If something doesn’t go into the bag, as soon as you’ve clicked on it, well, you might get bored and you might leave the site. Obviously, CAC scores are really important; we take a look at that. That’s how we measure, in terms of is this performance really doing very well against our best performing business as usual creative. So we take a look at that. And that can be different depending on the market. We do have a refer a friend program, which, if you refer a friend, you get some money off your next box, and they get money off their first box. On a regular basis, that can sometimes be topped up, so you can give people free boxes, and as we all know, word of mouth is incredibly important. We can measure that as well on who signed up and who stayed as a consumer as a result of that, which is really interesting. We also have a good feedback metric, where we look at this on a regular basis. So we look at our net promoter score for all of our meals. So we can take a look at anywhere at any time how all of the food is performing and for example, when you go into the site and you pause your delivery for one week, there is always there’s like, why did I pause? And we look at that very, very closely to look at the reasons why people are stopping their subscription, because that helps us and informs us with okay, well, if it’s actually to do with product, is it to do with the service, the delivery, which it can, unfortunately. It can be anything, but I think that gives us an insight into why people stop. Therefore, we’re also like, no, please don’t, if we make this better, we can come back and unpause. CRM is a very big part of that. So that’s obviously also to do with our refer a friend program, but CRM and our communications with that, and understanding that as to how we, let’s say get over that. But I think metrics wise, those are our biggest things that we really look at in terms of how do we overcome it?

 

Peggy Anne Salz 

When do you pull the plug, that’s a very important part of the campaign, it’s almost as much as understanding who your high-value users are, as to understanding when the creative isn’t working, nothing’s working, something tells you, it’s time to stop that they have just moved from the moveable middle, down to the end of the road.

 

Emma Baines 

Where I’m trying to get to is also pre-empting that a little bit and trying to ensure that that doesn’t happen. And that’s why we have all of this data why we have consumer insights, taking into consideration all of the information that we have about our consumers. So, for example, the burger, okay, well, if that one, if that ad over here isn’t working, and it’s a burger, let’s just pull that, let’s just not have it anywhere. And then I see it crop up in a suggestion for one of the hero dishes in our TBC. I’m like no not having it. Because if there’s any, if there is any way that that might hamper the performance of our TV ad, which it may do, then let’s not go there. Let’s just not even consider it. And I think we’ve got to be brave and pull the plug on things even though it may have taken some time to put something together. But if it isn’t performing, then let’s pull the plug. But ideally, we would have set ourselves up for success beforehand so that we know okay, this is likely to perform. Or have a backup option as well. That’s really, really important. If we’re putting something out there, that’s a little bit different. And we are this year, for example, in our TV campaign, we’ve done a series of shorts that have a very health-focused message. Now, this is very different for us to have such a specific message as part of the television campaign. So we’ll try and test that in a few markets and if it doesn’t work, we’ll pull it. And I think we know, however, coupled with the fact that we’ve created a process spot that we know will engage and educate the consumer, so we have our safety net. But we’ve also tried something a little bit different. And I think the two together, it’s really, really important. So you can therefore be in the position where you can go, okay, that didn’t work, scrap it, this we know is going to work, let’s keep it. And then, of course, it’s an amazing surprise and not a surprise, but it’s an amazing outcome. If it does, if it does perform as well.

 

John Koetsier 

Well, maybe we’ll ask you our last question, which we asked every single guest, and that is on the golden rule of retention. I’m not sure there is a golden rule Peggy, maybe we just invented that I’m not 100% certain, but hey, we’re saying there’s a golden rule of retention. Unfortunately, of course, it’s different for everybody. Everybody has their own golden rule of retention. What is yours?

 

Emma 

I personally believe it’s about having a very consistent consumer journey and customer experience. Because if as a new customer, as a loyal customer, as someone in the middle, if you experience the best possible customer experience that you can get from that first ad or that first word of mouth, or someone telling you about the product, right through to when that’s delivered, and you’ve cooked it, and you have enjoyed that meal and you’ve put a meal on the table that everyone enjoys, then that is the golden rule of retention. And that’s taking into consideration I know a lot of different areas of the business and different parts and so many different levers are pulled to get to that moment. But if you get it right, that person is a loyal customer, and that is absolutely worth it. And that’s why we do what we do every day to ensure that consistency of the brand.

 

John Koetsier 

Love it. Love it. Love it. Thank you so much, Emma, for joining us on CleverTap Engage.

 

Emma Baines 

Thank you so much. It’s been a pleasure speaking to you.

 

John Koetsier 

Wonderful and for all our audience hey, if you’re watching the video, check out the audio podcast which is great to consume on the go, if you’re on the go in these days. And if you’re on the audio version, search for us on YouTube to chill and relax and watch us whenever you want.

 

Peggy Anne Salz 

And you can also get involved because, hey, this podcast is about finding the world’s best marketers, getting their top tips. We focus, as you see on major brands, big stories to tell even growth stories. If you fit the bill, then DM John or me on Twitter or LinkedIn email me at [email protected] let’s get you set up soon with your own show. Until then, this is Peggy Anne Salz.

 

John Koetsier 

And this is John Koetsier for CleverTap Engage.

Posted on October 15, 2021